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Probably relevant life and body positivity tip from a sewist, pattern drafter and seamstress:
The clothes are the problem. Please try to remember that you are not the wrong shape, size or dimensions. If the shirt doesn't button closed the shirt is too narrow, you're not too wide. If the dress sags at the back it's the dress pattern, not your ass. Absolutely nobody makes clothes that are Actually Your Size unless you custom order or make them yourself. Even then fitting is a skill and an art!

You're not the problem, the clothes are.

in reply to Sini Tuulia

Sini Tuulia
Sini Tuulia
• •
This has been a two in the morning thought. I don't know if I should put some kind of content warning on there, I didn't think so, but please let me know if I should and I'll do it in the morning!
in reply to Sini Tuulia

Femme Malheureuse
Femme Malheureuse
• •

All that. It used to be that clothes were handmade to fit the person. It wasn't cheap but we respected our clothing more and it looked better on us; it was more sustainable consumption, too.

I can't think of a vintage photo of persons before mass manufacturing of clothes in which clothing didn't fit well save for laborers who dressed for their jobs and comfort.

in reply to Femme Malheureuse

Sini Tuulia
Sini Tuulia
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@femme_mal A lot of people would also buy second hand, but all in all they'd own less and use it until it wasn't wearable any more. Sometimes it didn't look very nice, but certainly much more sustainable.
@Femme Malheureuse
in reply to Sini Tuulia

Femme Malheureuse
Femme Malheureuse
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I think of Japan's boro with sashiko repairs as an example of extending use even beyond wearability. Old items became patches, beautified with stitching. No waste, only wabi-sabi.
in reply to Sini Tuulia

Jennie
Jennie
• •

A big issue I often have as a chubby short person, is that clothing manufacturers either assume that if you're short then you are skinny but if you're fat then you are 11 feet tall.

I just got a shirt today that fits great around my body, but it's so long! I'm going to try and hem it and hopefully it'll look fine.

in reply to Jennie

Angela
Angela
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@simplebadger27 as a tall leggy woman, I get the impression most "women's clothing" is designed for 5'2-5'7 bodies, that only get broader, never taller, and 26 inseam max
@Jennie
in reply to Angela

Cavyherd
Cavyherd
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@seawall @simplebadger27
I'd be grateful if I could FIND clothes for my inseam + waist circ. It's so frustrating that I went for years making my own jeans.
@Angela @Jennie
in reply to Cavyherd

Sini Tuulia
Sini Tuulia
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@cavyherd @seawall @simplebadger27
@MissConstrue It's cheaper to only make sizes that people can fit inside, not bothering with if it fits them! I'm quite short, have a small waist and tiny ribcage, wider shoulders and very very wide hips in proportion... Add a sway back, scoliosis and a bunch of other things and there is very rarely anything that fits. Which is why I started modifying and making my own clothes as early as the teenage years. Actually learning pattern drafting and fitting explained SO MUCH about why nothing ever looked good. Learning about the history of pattern drafting and garment manufacture then also made me angry!
@Cavyherd @Angela @MissConstrue @Jennie
in reply to Sini Tuulia

Cavyherd
Cavyherd
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@seawall @simplebadger27 @MissConstrue

Also, economies of scale apply. Basically, "create sizes that 80% of the population can sorta kinda make work, & call it a day."

There's a reason why the whole upscale men's suits thing has a tayloring step betw purchase and delivery.

@Angela @MissConstrue @Jennie
in reply to Sini Tuulia

MissConstrue
MissConstrue
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@cavyherd @seawall @simplebadger27 I saw a documentary once about sizing and how that worked, and was like Oh, ok, nothing is ever going to fit. Cool cool. 🀣
@Cavyherd @Angela @Jennie
in reply to MissConstrue

Cavyherd
Cavyherd
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@MissConstrue @seawall @simplebadger27

Huh. I'd be fascinated to see that.

I'm betting that "standard sizes" resolve to: "serviceable template that the end user modifies if they are so moved."

I actually got sick of having to take up the hems on all the pants I wore, & there's a local taylor who will do it for an entirely reasonable fee. Especially helpful when dealing with weird stretch fabrics that I have never been arsed to learn to deal with.

@Angela @MissConstrue @Jennie
Questa voce Γ¨ stata modificata (3 mesi fa)
in reply to Cavyherd

MissConstrue
MissConstrue
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@cavyherd @seawall @simplebadger27

IIRC, the way basic patterns work is the pattern is designed for a specific body type and size...for the last 40 years that has been a Twiggy shaped female who is a size 2. Then, rather than remeasuring how women with boobs and butts will change the flow of fabric, what they do is just expand the pattern lines by X inches (maybe 2?) for every size range over that. So, 2" for size 4, then 2 for 6, 2 for 8, etc....but then it gets weird when they get into women's sizes and plus sizes.
I have a whole book on how to modify patterns to fit busty and hippy women, but I'll be honest it's a little above my skill set. (A lot...it's a lot above my skill set. I can't figure out arm holes and sleeves, so...) But if you're interested, I can photo it.

I will try to find the documentary when I get home. I may have taken notes, which will make it easier to find. ( I hate trying to use my phone to research anything, multitabbing is just a pita.)

@Cavyherd @Angela @Jennie
in reply to MissConstrue

Giselle
Giselle
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@MissConstrue @cavyherd @seawall @simplebadger27
Full bust adjustment! It can be really fun to do (just measure the distance from mid shoulder seam down to the apex of your body first so that the bust dart points to it). When you do your first one and make it up in a cheap draft fabric, you put it on, and IT ACTUALLY FITS!!! Oh my god, best feeling in the world.
@Cavyherd @Angela @MissConstrue @Jennie
in reply to Giselle

Cavyherd
Cavyherd
• •

@Giselle @MissConstrue @seawall @simplebadger27

That is tech way beyond my ken πŸ˜‚ I'm generally happy if I'm covered & relatively clean....

@Angela @MissConstrue @Giselle @Jennie
in reply to Sini Tuulia

eena meena me
eena meena me
• •
every time i go shopping for clothes that need to cover my arms i get upset / disappointed, even when i go shopping for sports which you'd think would cater to long armed freaks like me
in reply to Sini Tuulia

anguinea
anguinea
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I noticed while reading up on tailoring that there is never a negative comment about the person’s body shape. Even in older books, the attitude is professional, even matter of fact.
in reply to anguinea

Sini Tuulia
Sini Tuulia
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@anguinea Yes! "If the body is shaped like this" followed by a neutral description "then do this" and it's to help make the person look good, feel good and be comfortable - not to rag on the person. A happy customer is a returning customer. They knew the magic of well fitting and well tailored clothes and knew you couldn't just guilt a person into changing their physical shape like some sort of sentient elastic blob. Just make the clothes better!
@anguinea
in reply to anguinea

Elena ``of Valhalla''
Elena ``of Valhalla''
•
@πšŠπš—πšπšžπš’πš—πšŽπšŠ :maxwell_cat: @Sini Tuulia I wonder about the language in tailoring books from the 1800s: they talk (a lot) about defects and ways a body is *wrong*, but it was also in a context where you weren't supposed to be the right shape, you were supposed to add MOAR padding until the dress is the right shape (and that's what the books talk about).
@anguinea @Sini Tuulia
in reply to Elena ``of Valhalla''

Sini Tuulia
Sini Tuulia
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@valhalla @anguinea I tried to think about reading those, but it's fully possible I had my Oldey Times Filter on in my brain whilst reading Victorian material, or I haven't read the judgemental ones!
@Elena ``of Valhalla'' @anguinea
in reply to Elena ``of Valhalla''

anguinea
anguinea
• •

@valhalla
To be honest, I was looking at books from the 1930's.

Considering how extreme some of the silhouettes were expected to be throughout the 1800's, anyone walking through a tailor's doorway would be less of a design project and more of an engineering project. Ouch. ⏳

@Elena ``of Valhalla''
in reply to anguinea

Sini Tuulia
Sini Tuulia
• •
@anguinea @valhalla Some of the trends and fads were kind of cumbersome and ridiculous (sleeve puff crinolines and hobble skirts, anyone?) but corsets and padding are actually quite comfortable! You will not catch me wearing eight petticoats, though, so it's steel bustle cages or a maximum of two petticoats only for me. πŸ˜†
Tailored jackets? Very very very heavy with all the inner layers, but feel more like armour than a straitjacket!
@Elena ``of Valhalla'' @anguinea
in reply to Sini Tuulia

P J Evans
P J Evans
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My mother made long-sleeved shirts for my father, because otherwise the sleeves would have covered his hand.
in reply to Sini Tuulia

Lars Wirzenius
Lars Wirzenius
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I have this for shoes and men's clothes, too.
in reply to Lars Wirzenius

Sini Tuulia
Sini Tuulia
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@liw Men's sizing is possibly even more garbage in multiple ways! Shoes are also kind of a shit show, feet are very finicky and to be truly comfortable you'll need to be lucky and know what you need to look for.
@Lars Wirzenius
in reply to Sini Tuulia

Dorothea Salo
Dorothea Salo
• •

@liw there's a line I love in the Highwomen's song Redesigning Women:

"and if the shoe fits I'm gonna buy eleven"

IT ME

@Lars Wirzenius
in reply to Sini Tuulia

petpet
petpet
• •
I boycott places where they offer small sizes only in retail shops and tell you to buy anything from L (!) in their online shop. e.g.
#uniqlo_official
#uniqlo_official
in reply to Sini Tuulia

Marta πŸŒΏπŸƒ
Marta πŸŒΏπŸƒ
• •
Yeah, I'm ready for those automatically generated clothes that were promised by sci-fi writers ages ago.

Anban Govender reshared this.

in reply to Marta πŸŒΏπŸƒ

Sini Tuulia
Sini Tuulia
• •
@Triffen Honestly we could probably produce knitwear to people's exact measurements already. Heck, we did that at school when we were learning machine knitting: We calculated the pattern based on our individual sizes, and then did maths to translate that to stitch count and such according to a test swatch with the yarn... And onto the machines we went. True, we did it by hand and thus were the computer, but there's no reason you couldn't just let the computer be the computer!
@Marta πŸŒΏπŸƒ
in reply to Sini Tuulia

Elena ``of Valhalla''
Elena ``of Valhalla''
•

@Sini Tuulia @Marta πŸŒΏπŸƒ and the technology is already here to take a number of measurements, let a computer draft a pattern for sewn clothing, and then have a human sew them the way all other mass produced garments are sewn, except they would fit significantly better (even if less than clothing that has been fitted on the body).

I think that there are companies providing that service, but I suspect mostly in the countries where most clothing are already been made.

@Sini Tuulia @Marta πŸŒΏπŸƒ
Unknown parent

Sini Tuulia
Sini Tuulia
• •
@steggy Exactly! We had an entire pattern drafting curriculum in dressmaking school, and went quite deep into how the standard sizes were developed (at least the European ones we used) and that there's meant to be a different set for a full five or six *different body types* and another for the different heights! A full 12 different standard size categories as opposed to just one. And that's just to start with: You're supposed to use those to draft a sloper to start with, if you're in a rush with clients, and then make a personal one from the fitting adjustments.
Me, myself, am in the "Short D" body shape (hip heavy) category but have my measurements scattered across four different sizes. One doesn't even fit inside the standard range! πŸ˜† And this is normal! Bodies are different!
@Steggy
in reply to Sini Tuulia

MissConstrue
MissConstrue
• •
My grandmother was a dressmaker of extraordinary skill. A skill which I do not have, sadly. I wish I knew a dressmaker. I know it’s an expensive way to dress, but the whole idea of having a few foundation pieces that are the colors and fabric I want, custom fit to my difficult hourglass…the thought is intoxicating. πŸ₯°. I’m so glad artists like you exist.
in reply to MissConstrue

Sini Tuulia
Sini Tuulia
• •
@MissConstrue I am very much an hourglass, though a bottom heavy one, and I started out making do with buying to fit my bust and shoulders in there, and then taking in the waist and back! I'd also need to add a gusset/gore to widen the high hip to button them closed below the waist... Modifications and tailoring existing clothes is cheaper than construction from scratch, so you might be able to afford to have several pieces fitted to you by a dressmaker. πŸ€” Depends on everything, of course, but in case that's helpful!
@MissConstrue
Unknown parent

Sini Tuulia
Sini Tuulia
• •
@Anathema You're very welcome! It was one of the most important lessons we got taught in pattern drafting class, in addition to the actual drafting!
Ah, the modern clothing industry is horrible in so many ways.
@🌬️ Anathema 🌬️
in reply to Sini Tuulia

Sally Strange
Sally Strange
• •

Relevant: wondering why your favorite actor looks so fabulous in just jeans and a t-shirt? It's because their clothes are tailored to them specifically.

@sinituulia

@Sini Tuulia
in reply to Sally Strange

Sini Tuulia
Sini Tuulia
• •
@SallyStrange And when they're not, they probably have an assistant or stylist or both to wade through every single available thing on earth to find the one thing that does fit and look good right away! People whose literal career it is to make sure they look good!
@Sally Strange
in reply to Sini Tuulia

Elyse M Grasso
Elyse M Grasso
• •
I have worn men's dress shirts and winter jackets for years because I need a 32/33 sleeve (US sizing) and women's clothes aren't made with those. Fortunately I was always flat enough on top that was a useful workaround, though the shirts were usually way too long in the torso.
Unknown parent

Sini Tuulia
Sini Tuulia
• •
Bodies are complicated, and I'd have happily ceded to someone's more educated opinion if I'd accidentally fucked up! But I'm glad it seems like I didn't πŸ˜„
Questa voce Γ¨ stata modificata (3 mesi fa)
in reply to Sini Tuulia

TomKrajci πŸ‡ΊπŸ‡¦ πŸ³οΈβ€πŸŒˆ πŸ³οΈβ€βš§οΈ
TomKrajci πŸ‡ΊπŸ‡¦ πŸ³οΈβ€πŸŒˆ πŸ³οΈβ€βš§οΈ
• •

I'm 6ft 4in tall (193 cm).

I say that about most every glider cockpit I climb into - the cockpit is the problem.

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