#askFedi would you like to have the possibility to make multilingual (ML) posts, i.e. a *single* post with the text available in multiple languages *at once*? Currently, you have to either do separate posts, or squeeze multiple languages within your server's character limit, and only mark it for one of the languages (see e.g. sociale.network/@oblomov/11087… + sociale.network/@oblomov/11498…).
(Select appropriate option based on whether you're a native English speaker.)
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Pitch Heres a thought for a mastodon feature - allowing people to translate posts. Like, when you write a post, you have the option to add translations for multiple languages - so, if you wanted, y...
I don't think that posting messages in multiple languages is the solution Client side translation is enough, only it should be made easier to have them (less steps, less clicks, maybe a button right there) There could be cases where it's necessary to have a translation by the author (difficult or ambiguous or not poetic translations by local software)
@filobus hard disagree. Client-side translation should only be considerd a low-quality fallback for the cases where the author did not/could not provide a translation themselves. Allowing users to provide their own translations is an important step to improve the internationalization of the Fediverse.
it is not so clear: the author should provide a translation in... English? Or all the languages of all the readers? Esperanto? The author should be very proficient, and who is not? Software translation could be even better, but the author could not use it because thinks it's better h* own Author should have time and put much effort
And one thing doesn't exclude the other, the reader is free to use client's software, the author is free to provide different translations
@filobus authors should be ALLOWED to provide translations in any language they want. It's not an obligation, it's an option. I for one would like most of my posts to be dual Italian/English. @valhalla often makes the same post twice, once in Italian and once in English (yes, I'm aware that gl-como is on Friendica so an improvement to Mastodon wouldn't benefit it). @Puxi also does multilingual posts, encountering exactly the issues I mention in the poll (wrong language tagging, and need to fit.)
@valhalla @Puxi yes, I'm not against it, I too write in Italian OR an awful English, and writing in both I tried and found it awkward Maybe I overreacted to you finding appalling using client side translation, I find client side translation still awkward too
@filobus @valhalla @Puxi I'm not against client-side translations as a matter of principle. I am against their existence as a reason to not allow authors to provide their own translations.
@filobus @valhalla @Puxi i don't want this feature because people will provide text with different meanings in different languages. Let's say put a witty clever take in English and blattant hate speech in French. So English reader will retoot and give visibility to hate in good faith.
It's just like alt text don't assume people will make good usage of a feature just because it exists
@lutindiscret @filobus @valhalla @Puxi my poll currently has a 60%+ of people interested in the feature. The kind of abusive behavior you mention would be a bannable offence, dealt through moderation like any form of abusive use of the platform. And just like alt text, we should not reject a positive feature only because some may not make good use of it.
Most of the people I interact with speak either English or Italian, so when I write posts I tend to write in English and then translate in Italian in a comment, and being able to mark the two as two versions of the same post would be quite neat!
(also being able to explicitely set the language of the post would be really nice, because as is I don't think that people even on mastodon are able to use translation services at all)
also, maybe we should drop @Puxi_Il_Gatto :tootcat: @toot.cat from the list of mentions? I don't think that mew_IT is included in any list of languages (and that's discrimination! :D )
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Oblomov
in reply to Oblomov • • •#askFedi would you like to have the possibility to make multilingual (ML) posts, i.e. a *single* post with the text available in multiple languages *at once*? Currently, you have to either do separate posts, or squeeze multiple languages within your server's character limit, and only mark it for one of the languages (see e.g. sociale.network/@oblomov/11087… + sociale.network/@oblomov/11498…).
(Select appropriate option based on whether you're a native English speaker.)
#poll #internationalization #languages
Oblomov (@oblomov@sociale.network)
sociale.network- native EN speaker, don't care about ML posts (17%, 7 votes)
- native EN speaker, would like ML posts (40%, 16 votes)
- non-native EN speaker, don't care about ML posts (10%, 4 votes)
- non-native EN speaker, would like ML posts (32%, 13 votes)
40 voters. Poll end: in 5 giornireshared this
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Oblomov
in reply to Oblomov • • •Relevant Mastodon issues:
github.com/mastodon/mastodon/i…
github.com/mastodon/mastodon/i…
TBH, I find the comments suggesting that “DeepL [or any other client-side translation service] is enough” to be appalling.
Allow people to translate their toots.
Angular-Angel (GitHub)filobus
in reply to Oblomov • • •Client side translation is enough, only it should be made easier to have them (less steps, less clicks, maybe a button right there)
There could be cases where it's necessary to have a translation by the author (difficult or ambiguous or not poetic translations by local software)
Oblomov
in reply to filobus • • •filobus
in reply to Oblomov • • •it is not so clear: the author should provide a translation in... English? Or all the languages of all the readers? Esperanto? The author should be very proficient, and who is not? Software translation could be even better, but the author could not use it because thinks it's better h* own
Author should have time and put much effort
And one thing doesn't exclude the other, the reader is free to use client's software, the author is free to provide different translations
Oblomov
in reply to filobus • • •I for one would like most of my posts to be dual Italian/English. @valhalla often makes the same post twice, once in Italian and once in English (yes, I'm aware that gl-como is on Friendica so an improvement to Mastodon wouldn't benefit it).
@Puxi also does multilingual posts, encountering exactly the issues I mention in the poll (wrong language tagging, and need to fit.)
filobus
in reply to Oblomov • • •Maybe I overreacted to you finding appalling using client side translation, I find client side translation still awkward too
Oblomov
in reply to filobus • • •Lutin Discret
in reply to Oblomov • • •@filobus @valhalla @Puxi i don't want this feature because people will provide text with different meanings in different languages. Let's say put a witty clever take in English and blattant hate speech in French. So English reader will retoot and give visibility to hate in good faith.
It's just like alt text don't assume people will make good usage of a feature just because it exists
Oblomov
in reply to Lutin Discret • • •Elena ``of Valhalla''
in reply to Oblomov • •@Oblomov @filobus
yes, please, also in #friendica, pliz!
Most of the people I interact with speak either English or Italian, so when I write posts I tend to write in English and then translate in Italian in a comment, and being able to mark the two as two versions of the same post would be quite neat!
(also being able to explicitely set the language of the post would be really nice, because as is I don't think that people even on mastodon are able to use translation services at all)
also, maybe we should drop @Puxi_Il_Gatto :tootcat: @toot.cat from the list of mentions? I don't think that mew_IT is included in any list of languages (and that's discrimination! :D )
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