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Looking for a mom-and-pops-friendly IM solution


tl;dr: I'm looking for an alternative to #Whatsapp that is easy enough for my nontechie family to use. So far, #Matrix looks like the most complete solution, but seems pretty slow these days for some reason. Also, I have reasons on why I'm not 100% on choosing #XMPP this time.

What is the alternative you would recommend to mom and dad?

#CambridgeAnalytica leaks and #Facebook scandals apart, I've already been looking for an alternative to WhatsApp for many years, with the largest hurdle in this crusade definitely being the fact that my family hasn't been keen on leaving it for another app. On my side, I have the following requirements:
  • End-to-end #Encryption enabled by default, or at least built into the program (native implementation, no third party plugins)
  • Clients exist for at least GNU/Linux and Android platforms (more is better, but not needed)
  • Support for group chats with E2EE
  • Supports at least text and image transferring.
Matching all of these used to be very tough for a chat program, until about two years ago. With the tremendous progress that the XMPP movement has been doing for the past two or so years, I was hard-pressed to inevitably tell them to immediately download #Conversations for their phones and find true #privacy with #OMEMO encryption and their chats. However...

OMEMO isn't exactly a silver bullet (yet).


First off, allow me to clarify one thing: I love XMPP. I think it is a very mature and very reliable protocol, has a very diverse ecosystem of servers and clients around and has worked very well for me so far. With that said, though, the entire Go OMEMO! isn't exactly the magical crypto bullet that will save every one from surveillance. Or at least not yet.

First off, adoption of OMEMO in client applications has been slow. The only one that actually gets it right in my opinion is Conversations, but that's a phone app - a privacy nightmare. On the desktop, we have few options, and, from experience, none is mature to the point of surviving heavy usage:
  • Gajim - the go-to answer everyone receives - doesn't have native support, and the OMEMO plug-in requires little-tested versions that are unstable, or link to libraries whose versions some distros like Debian and Ubuntu do not offer, even if you add the development Gajim repo.
  • Profanity has at least two plug-ins for OMEMO (python and C), but they are also in the early stages of development (when I tested the python one, it didn't allow me to send messages, just receive).
  • Pidgin seems to have released an OMEMO library, but given the time of the release, I doubt it's any more stable than the above.
  • Dino appears to offer native support, but is still in alpha stage.
I know that this site indicates many other programs having some or full support for OMEMO already, but quite frankly, in my experience it's not accurate at all from the experience of a user (see my points above).

So much for requirement #2...

Enter (or not) the Matrix


So while I was busy digging for the grail, all the cool kids seemed to have switched to something called Matrix, specifically through the Riot webapp. Citing full integration over many different communication networks, I also decided to give it a try because, well, why not?

Turns out that Riot is glossy and bloated, but yes, fairly easy to use - very much like WhatsApp itself. That could be a selling point to the non-techies! And they have E2EE that apparently has been audited already. And it does fulfill all the four requirements I have. But I still am a little unsure about a few things:
  • By using the Riot web interface, you have to use Javascript to do cryptography. I know that the implementation was audited, but the whole thing about trusting Javascript still gives me the creeps. Also: RIP my RAM.
  • Desktop clients for Matrix are, very much like XMPP, lacking. Riot-desktop seems to be just a thin wrapper around the webapp. The weechat plugin last time I checked does not support encryption, etc.
  • It is mysteriously very slow these days. It seems that this is because of people overloading a few of the already few servers around and not wishing to host more, thus resulting in a very inefficient federation and network. That wasn't the case when I first tried it two years ago. This will not help convince WhatsApp users.
But even with all the above considered, I still think that Matrix, through the Riot App and Webapp is the best way to go to convince nontechies to move away from WhatsApp. I'm not praising Matrix either, though. It always sounded to me like a project that wanted to do everything, and seeing the bloat I get for what I intend to use it for, it seems to have kept going that way.

Perhaps when one day OMEMO finds its way into native or mature implementations in XMPP clients, I will revisit this post and lean towards XMPP again. But so far, no single free software IM solution has been 100% satisfactory in my case, and I'm still looking for more alternatives.

What is the alternative you would recommend to mom and dad?

 

Finally, I have deleted my #Google account today!


It was a long an challenging breakup. It started roughly 2 years ago, when I was not able to ignore anymore that Google started switching to the #darkside.

You can easily guess which social network I use instead of #googleplus. [Yes, I use and <3 #diaspora* ;-).]
Instead of #gmail, I use the email account provided by my workplace and #disroot for personal emails.
I chat by using #xmpp (via clients #conversations and #gajim using #omemo for #encryption).
I use #davdroid to synchronize my contact list, calendar and tasklist to my #moblie.
Instead of #chrome, I use #firefox, #torbrowser, #iceweasel, and #icecat.
Instead of #webmail, use #thundebird, #icedove and #k9 email clients.
I use #nextcloud and #syncthing, instead of #googledrive.
For #searching, I sue #duckduckgo and #searx.
Instead of #android, I use #replicant.

Instead of paying with my #privacy, I pay with #donation using #liberapay.


I'm also grateful to @Tiberiu C. Turbureanu (from #technoethical) for helping me fixing my broken replicant install.

 

XMPP-Meetup Berlin: Daniel Gultsch about good and bad client UX



Next Meeting:

Thursday, 2018-06-07, 19:00

co-up, Adalbertstr. 8, 10999 Berlin

Daniel Gultsch:
I’m going to talk about how to deal with baggage and how legacy UX (something that long time users are used to from other clients) makes it difficult to create good clients. (Which for example lead to the creation of the infamous »Expert Settings«.)
#xmpp #berlin #meeting #ux #android #conversations #federation

 

Have you considered the alternative?



Good read. The authors make clear, that end-to-end encryption, as important as it is, is not the most important tool to protect privacy. Federation or decentralization is much more important. They also see clearly, that centralized messengers have much better funding opportunities than federated ones.
While OWS provides thorough expertise in the field of cryptography, Marlinspike is currently advocating centralisation as the only answer towards user-friendly, fast and secure messaging apps. Decentralisation, according to him, has no place in the modern world and apparently hampers innovation. However, some of his arguments have not remained unchallenged. In particular, where Marlinspike accuses federation of stalling evolution, Daniel Gultsch provides a counter argument by using the Web as an example of successfully federated system. Furthermore, Gultsch states that the problem is not that federation doesn't adapt, but rather that there are problems with its implementation for a very significant reason: software developers working on federated systems mostly work for free in their spare time or with little means, given the difficulty to monetise a system which design can only succeed if it is open and can be appropriated easily beyond its original scope, and thus making its capitalisation particularly challenging. In that sense, the most interesting aspect of this debate is that while Marlinspike seems to defend his product from a technological perspective, Gultsch's counter argument moves back the discussion to the context of political economy.

Hosting your own infrastructure allows you to scale your communication in a way that is the most meaningful for the group or community you belong to. It is also a way to make sure your system matches your own threat model?, while simultaneously allowing you to deal with trust that is not mediated by an app. It also allows you to experiment with economic models other than those linked to large-scale infrastructure involving surveillance and capturing of your social graph for financial gain. Maybe you want to share the cost of the server or the responsibilities of administrating it, maybe you want to collectively learn how to run all this stuff, or maybe you want to start meetings to exchange tips, etc. However, this does not mean that you need to cut yourself off from the rest of the world and this form of localism should not be misunderstood for a hipsterist and reactionary form of escapism. Instead, such an approach is quite the opposite as it provides a possibility to actively engage with societal issues. It allows groups to collectively think, in the sense of defining questions and hypotheses themselves, acquire skills and knowledge and respond to issues that are both relevant to their own situation but that can also resonate globally, enabling others to start a similar process.
#whatsapp #facebook #signal #xmpp #conversations #gajim #chatsecure #selfhosting #federation #politics #freesoftware

 

XMPP-Meetup in Berlin



XMPP Council member Daniel Gultsch, also known for his Android application Conversations, will explain how the XMPP Standards Foundation (XSF) works and how an XMPP Extension Protocol (XEP) emerge.

Monday, 2018-05-14 19:00 CEST, location see link

#berlin #xmpp #conversations #xsf #xep

 
Should someone of you use #Conversations 2.0+, you might want to update

Daniel Gultsch ha scritto:

“Please update to Con­ver­sa­tions 2.1.4 ASAP. Avail­able on both Google Play and F-​Droid. This fixes our first crit­ical secur­ity issue. More details will fol­low after the major­ity of people have upgraded. Con­ver­sa­tions Leg­acy and Con­ver­sa­tions prior to 2.0 are not affected.”


source (twitter)

#xmpp #jabber

 

Note to myself: How to disable OTR in ChatSecure



Some weeks ago, a colleague, who unfortunately uses an iPhone (he is not a completely bad person, though) installed ChatSecure. Immediately, I and others were annoyed by unreadable OTR garbage he sent. It took us a while, but at the end of the day (the whole day!) we found out how to disable OTR. Yesterday, a friend who unfortunately also uses an iPhone (he is not a completely bad person neither), had the same issue and it took me the help of strangers on the internet (here; the Conversations MUC), to remember what to do. For the next time and the benefit of the public:
  • One cannot disable OTR globally in ChatSecure, but only contact by contact.
  • You need to open the chat of the contact.
  • Go to the "contact details".
  • Go to "advanced encryption settings" and select "OMEMO", nothing else.
  • Close chat with the contact.
  • Repeat the last four steps for all your 511 contacts.
#xmpp #ios #iphone #otr #omemo #chatsecure #conversations

 

The rocky road to OMEMO by default



Daniel Gultsch, developer of Android XMPP client Conversations, writes,

Why it took us more than two years to enable End-to-End encryption by default: The first in a series of essays leading up to the release of Conversations 2.0



...
The other big hurdle we had to overcome was the adoption rate in clients. If you send OMEMO encrypted messages by default you should have a reasonable expectation that your contact will be able to decrypt the message. Reasonable expectation doesn’t mean that every single client out there has to support it—In an ecosystem with hundreds of small, badly maintained clients that’s just not feasible—but the major clients should at least have a plugin available.
In March 2018 we finally reached the point where every plattform has one or more clients with OMEMO support. Conversations and Zom on Android, ChatSecure on iOS, Psi and Gajim on the desktop. The up and coming desktop client Dino—despite not having had an initial release—already has support for OMEMO as well. And even the webclient JSXC has a plugin available.
Considering the complexity of OMEMO and the fact that most of these clients are developed by people in their spare time, this is actually quite an impressive adoption rate.
...
Moxie Marlinspike, in his 2016 propaganda piece ignorantly bashing XMPP, had one valid point: Enabling end-to-end encryption in a homogenous environment is easier than introducing it in a heterogenous one like Jabber. Nobody is denying that. However, if something is hard to achieve there are two possible approaches: Either try your best and don’t give up, or put your head in the sand and create yet another walled garden that is no different from other proprietary solutions.
Admittedly it has taken us a while to get to a point where we can enable end-to-end encryption by default, but it was worth the effort in that we ended up with something that is different from WhatsApp in more than just marketing.
#xmpp #omemo #conversations #psi #gajim #zom #chatsecure #dino #jsxc #federation #encryption

 

Biboumi - An XMPP-IRC Gateway



Debian maintainer Vasudeva Kamath writes in their blog:
IRC is a communication mode (technically a communication protocol) used by many Free Software projects for communication and collaboration. It is serving these projects well even 30 years after its inception. Though I'm pretty much okay with IRC I had a problem of not able to use IRC from the mobile phones. Main problem is the inconsistent network connection, where IRC needs always to be connected. This is where I came across Biboumi.
Biboumi by itself does not have anything to do with mobile phones, its just a gateway which will allow you to connect with IRC channel as if it is a XMPP MUC room from any XMPP client. Benefit of this is it allows to enjoy some of XMPP feature in your IRC channel (not all but those which can be mapped).
He then explains in detail how to configure Ejabberd with Biboumi and how to actually use Biboumi from the XMPP client, e.g. Conversations. Worth a read!

I'm using Biboumi, too. Both via the wonderful movim.eu social network site, but also at my company, where we run it behind the Prosody XMPP server.

#gateway #irc #mobile #xmpp #ejbberd #biboumi #conversations

 

Conversations Open Source Secure XMPP Client for Android



This article on XDA-Developers focusses on encryption features of Conversations and an interview with developer Daniel Gultsch. Nice read!
Q: What motivated you to develop Conversations?
A: I am using Jabber/XMPP for many many years. Even back in 2009 I was able to use Jabber on my Nokia e71. Sometime around the year 2012 I switched to an Android phone, so I suddenly was unable to use Jabber. [...]
Q: Can you give three reasons why Conversations protects your privacy better than Whatsapp or Threema?
A: I don’t have to give my private phone number to strangers if I want to chat with them. I could have a private and a business account. I can disable the business account after my shift, to prevent my boss from annoying me during my free time. WhatsApp allows everybody to analyze my app usage patterns any time. (My boss could stalk me to investigate if I am using WhatsApp during my working hours or if I am using WhatsApp at night instead of sleeping and coming well rested to the office.) This is different with Conversations; Conversations also doesn’t upload my entire address book to Facebook.
Q: Is it allowed to compile Conversations on your own from your Github and use it for private use?
A: Of course. Not only private, also for business and everything else you want. It is also allowed to modify the code to meet individual requirements.
#conversations #freesoftware #xmpp #android #interview #pgp #otr #omemo #forwardsecrecy #xda https://www.xda-developers.com/conversations-jabber-xmpp-android/

 

"How to Live Without Google" - and getting it all wrong



In a failed attempt to improve users personal privacy, DuckDuckGo jumps from the frying pan straight into the fire. With the motto
Remove Google from your life? Yes, it can be done!
they give ten advices, most of them very bad. Also, they are using inexact wording by calling things free, when they are "free as in beer", but not necessarily "free as in freedom". I comment on their three worst recommendations:
Google Search -> DuckDuckGo (free)
Let's start off with the easiest one! Switching to DuckDuckGo not only keeps your searches private but also gives you extra advantages such as our bang shortcuts, handy Instant Answers, and knowing you're not trapped in a filter bubble.
I understand, that they advertise their own service here. And while I do believe, that DuckDuckGo does not cheat and keeps your searches private, as a user, one cannot prove it. In any case, one just replaces one centralised search machine with another one. Better use a decentralised service, such as meta search engine Searx.
Android -> iOS (paid)
The most popular alternative to Android is of course iOS, which offers easy device encryption and encrypted messaging via iMessage by default. We also have tips to increase privacy protection on your iPhone or iPad.
This is certainly the worst recommendation in their list. I had to check the date of the article, when I read this. Aprils Fool's Day? I'm certainly not a fan of Android and I'm not an Android user anymore, but going for a much more restrictive jail is just stupid. Android has at least relatively free versions, e.g. Replicant. iOS, in contrast, is a carcel with beautifully painted walls. Very high walls with perfectly styled barbed wire on top. Even the most proprietary variants of Android let you at least install free software from F-Droid.org.

If you don't want to use Android anymore, like myself, better go for a free alternative, e.g. support the Librem 5 crowdfunding, or the Pyra handheld or the ZeroPhone, all three running the free Debian operating system.
Google Allo -> Signal (free)
There are several services offering private messaging but, as we've mentioned before, Signal gets our recommendation. It offers free, end-to-end encryption for both messages and private calls. It's also recommended by Edward Snowden and renowned security expert Bruce Schneier, among others.
Again, they recommend to leave one centralised service for another one. And one, that even wants your phone number, otherwise you can't use it. And one, that does not yet have a decent client for Linux. There are messengers around that are federated or completely decentralised, that do not force you give them your phone number, and that have native clients for all major operating systems. My recommendation is XMPP. If you are on Linux, use e.g. Gajim, on Android the best app is probably Conversations, for iOS there is ChatSecure and so on. Alternatives to XMPP are Ring, Matrix and more recently Wire.

Benjamin Franklin wrote in 1755:
Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
One should also not give up libre software, which is essential in many ways, to purchase a little perceived safety or privacy through non-free or centralised services.

#duckduckgo #google #searx #replicant #fdroid #librem5 #pyra #zerophone #debian #xmpp #gajim #conversations #chatsecure #ring #matrix #wire

How to Live Without Google

Google tracking is more pervasive than most people realize. We show you some alternatives to Google services to limit your exposure.

 
| Translate | Gitter

Why we don't publish at the Play Store



We got some requests recently, asking, why we do not publish #dandelion at the #GooglePlay.So here are our main reasons, why we don't plan to uploadthe app there currently.

First of all, we do not comply with Googles terms of service. Having to pay ~25€ to Google who did not write the app and does not respect your freedom nor your privacy on its platforms (Youtube, GMail...) just doesn't feel right. We believe, that our userbase is well aware of the privacy concerns that come with using Google's Services, so many diaspora* users actually get their apps through F-Droid (which is great). Second, if a user that does not know about F-Droid yet wants to use dandelion* and searches for it, they'll hopefully find out about the F-Droid project and may get in touch with free software that way. So by not publishing to Google Play, we hope to get more people to understand, use and appreciate free and open source software.

If you find dandelion* on the Play Store, please be aware, that you likely just found a version built by someone else. We can not guarantee that such a version has not been tampered with in terms of #malware, so we highly discourage you to use it. It should be clear, that we'll never charge you any money for using, downloading, sharing or modifying the app. Note also, that we won't support those versions.

If you want to dontate to the project to support the developers, and keep them motivated, please feel free to contact us :D As always, you can help us by submitting bug reports, code and/or translations on github and crowdin.
PS: We maintainers (@gsantner and @vanitasvitae) will soon have more time again to actively work on the app. The last weeks we were distracted with educational work, so here is some background information:

@gsantner was working on another FLOSS app called Froody, which lets you share (naturally growing) food and other things with others. He hopes to enable people to live a more sustainable life. The main idea is to share to and help other people by e.g. sharing pears, which would rot anyway if unused.Everything is built with international use in mind. The app is available at https://github.com/froodyapp/froody-android, and is currently available in #English, #German and #Japanese. Also translatable on Crowdin. He also writes his bachlor thesis about Open Source and Android, which will be completed in summer and likely to be released in an appropiate free license.

@vanitasvitae is writing his bachelor thesis about an #OMEMO module for #Smack, a #XMPP library used by many free messengers like #Jitsi or #Kontalk.
He hopes to enable those messengers to #encrypt your communication end-to-end using the OMEMO protocol introduced by #conversations.
He'll also attend #FOSDEM in #brussels by the way, so if you are there you might meet him and chat a little ;)

Sharing welcome!



Immagine/foto

Tags: #dandelion #dandeliondev #diaspora #diasporaforandroid #diasporaandroid #diasporaapp #app #fdroid #freesoftware #opensource #google #play #store #app #android-dev #foss #freie-software #freesoftware #opensource #translation #translator #release #mobile #froody #froodyapp #omemo #security #sustainability #sustainable #thesis

Diaspora-for-Android/dandelion

dandelion* - unofficial diaspora* android client

 
| Translate | Gitter

Why we don't publish at the Play Store



We got some requests recently, asking, why we do not publish #dandelion at the #GooglePlay.So here are our main reasons, why we don't plan to uploadthe app there currently.

First of all, we do not comply with Googles terms of service. Having to pay ~25€ to Google who did not write the app and does not respect your freedom nor your privacy on its platforms (Youtube, GMail...) just doesn't feel right. We believe, that our userbase is well aware of the privacy concerns that come with using Google's Services, so many diaspora* users actually get their apps through F-Droid (which is great). Second, if a user that does not know about F-Droid yet wants to use dandelion* and searches for it, they'll hopefully find out about the F-Droid project and may get in touch with free software that way. So by not publishing to Google Play, we hope to get more people to understand, use and appreciate free and open source software.

If you find dandelion* on the Play Store, please be aware, that you likely just found a version built by someone else. We can not guarantee that such a version has not been tampered with in terms of #malware, so we highly discourage you to use it. It should be clear, that we'll never charge you any money for using, downloading, sharing or modifying the app. Note also, that we won't support those versions.

If you want to dontate to the project to support the developers, and keep them motivated, please feel free to contact us :D As always, you can help us by submitting bug reports, code and/or translations on github and crowdin.
PS: We maintainers (@gsantner and @vanitasvitae) will soon have more time again to actively work on the app. The last weeks we were distracted with educational work, so here is some background information:

@gsantner was working on another FLOSS app called Froody, which lets you share (naturally growing) food and other things with others. He hopes to enable people to live a more sustainable life. The main idea is to share to and help other people by e.g. sharing pears, which would rot anyway if unused.Everything is built with international use in mind. The app is available at https://github.com/froodyapp/froody-android, and is currently available in #English, #German and #Japanese. Also translatable on Crowdin. He also writes his bachlor thesis about Open Source and Android, which will be completed in summer and likely to be released in an appropiate free license.

@vanitasvitae is writing his bachelor thesis about an #OMEMO module for #Smack, a #XMPP library used by many free messengers like #Jitsi or #Kontalk.
He hopes to enable those messengers to #encrypt your communication end-to-end using the OMEMO protocol introduced by #conversations.
He'll also attend #FOSDEM in #brussels by the way, so if you are there you might meet him and chat a little ;)

Sharing welcome!



Immagine/foto

Tags: #dandelion #dandeliondev #diaspora #diasporaforandroid #diasporaandroid #diasporaapp #app #fdroid #freesoftware #opensource #google #play #store #app #android-dev #foss #freie-software #freesoftware #opensource #translation #translator #release #mobile #froody #froodyapp #omemo #security #sustainability #sustainable #thesis

Diaspora-for-Android/dandelion

dandelion* - unofficial diaspora* android client

 
| Translate | Gitter

Why we don't publish at the Play Store



We got some requests recently, asking, why we do not publish #dandelion at the #GooglePlay.So here are our main reasons, why we don't plan to uploadthe app there currently.

First of all, we do not comply with Googles terms of service. Having to pay ~25€ to Google who did not write the app and does not respect your freedom nor your privacy on its platforms (Youtube, GMail...) just doesn't feel right. We believe, that our userbase is well aware of the privacy concerns that come with using Google's Services, so many diaspora* users actually get their apps through F-Droid (which is great). Second, if a user that does not know about F-Droid yet wants to use dandelion* and searches for it, they'll hopefully find out about the F-Droid project and may get in touch with free software that way. So by not publishing to Google Play, we hope to get more people to understand, use and appreciate free and open source software.

If you find dandelion* on the Play Store, please be aware, that you likely just found a version built by someone else. We can not guarantee that such a version has not been tampered with in terms of #malware, so we highly discourage you to use it. It should be clear, that we'll never charge you any money for using, downloading, sharing or modifying the app. Note also, that we won't support those versions.

If you want to dontate to the project to support the developers, and keep them motivated, please feel free to contact us :D As always, you can help us by submitting bug reports, code and/or translations on github and crowdin.
PS: We maintainers (@gsantner and @vanitasvitae) will soon have more time again to actively work on the app. The last weeks we were distracted with educational work, so here is some background information:

@gsantner was working on another FLOSS app called Froody, which lets you share (naturally growing) food and other things with others. He hopes to enable people to live a more sustainable life. The main idea is to share to and help other people by e.g. sharing pears, which would rot anyway if unused.Everything is built with international use in mind. The app is available at https://github.com/froodyapp/froody-android, and is currently available in #English, #German and #Japanese. Also translatable on Crowdin. He also writes his bachlor thesis about Open Source and Android, which will be completed in summer and likely to be released in an appropiate free license.

@vanitasvitae is writing his bachelor thesis about an #OMEMO module for #Smack, a #XMPP library used by many free messengers like #Jitsi or #Kontalk.
He hopes to enable those messengers to #encrypt your communication end-to-end using the OMEMO protocol introduced by #conversations.
He'll also attend #FOSDEM in #brussels by the way, so if you are there you might meet him and chat a little ;)

Sharing welcome!



Immagine/foto

Tags: #dandelion #dandeliondev #diaspora #diasporaforandroid #diasporaandroid #diasporaapp #app #fdroid #freesoftware #opensource #google #play #store #app #android-dev #foss #freie-software #freesoftware #opensource #translation #translator #release #mobile #froody #froodyapp #omemo #security #sustainability #sustainable #thesis

Diaspora-for-Android/dandelion

dandelion* - unofficial diaspora* android client

 

Blind Trust Before Verification



Very interesting article on how hard it is to get encryption and trust right. There is no silver bullet it seems, we can only strive hard.
WhatsApp - and pretty soon Signal as well - are the prime example of an industry turning End-to-End Encryption into a hollow marketing phrase that doesn’t mean anything.

#xmpp #omemo #conversations #signal #whatsapp

Blind Trust Before Verification

An introduction to the concept of Blind Trust Before Verification which means to automatically trust all new devices of contacts that haven’t been verified before, and prompt for manual confirmation each time a verified contact adds a new device.

 

End-to-End Encrypted group chats via XMPP



Jamie McClelland writes, that it is still difficult to have a secure group chat. But it's possible.
Use either Conversations for Android (f-droid or Play) or Gajim for Windows or Linux [...]

Ensure that everyone in your group has added everyone else in the group to their roster [...]

Create the group in the android Conversations app, not in Gajim [...]

#xmpp #muc #conversations #gajim #omemo #encryption

End-to-End Encrypted group chats via XMPP


 
Daniel Gultsch's (developer of Conversations, a very usable messenger that uses a decentralized protocol) reply to Moxie Marlinspike's (main developer of Signal, a very usable messenger that uses a centralized protocol):

https://gultsch.de/objection.html

#xmpp #jabber #conversations #signal

Conversations: the very last word in instant messaging

A free and open source Jabber/XMPP client for Android. Easy to use, reliable, battery friendly. With built-in support for images, group chats and e2e encryption.

 
Daniel Gultsch's (developer of Conversations, a very usable messenger that uses a decentralized protocol) reply to Moxie Marlinspike's (main developer of Signal, a very usable messenger that uses a centralized protocol):

https://gultsch.de/objection.html

#xmpp #jabber #conversations #signal

Conversations: the very last word in instant messaging

A free and open source Jabber/XMPP client for Android. Easy to use, reliable, battery friendly. With built-in support for images, group chats and e2e encryption.

 
#tox works good from my experience. #conversations with #xmpp +#omemo is solid as stone as well.